A project crying out to be done!

[Heroformosa]

That all sounds good! I'll let you know how I get on with the first steps....

[Kommando]

Sunny Boy 2500's can be reset to Windy Boy's using Sunny DATA Control and an RS485 piggyback card. Once reset there is a utility to set the turbine profile on the WB which I can provide a copy of.

Manual for the utility is here

https://files.sma.de/downloads/WBSetup-BEN100411.pdf

[Heroformosa]

Thanks, Kommando. I'll add that into the information I'm gathering. Countrypaul - I now have information on the WT output from Hugh Piggott, who installed it:
"The output of the turbine is 3-phase. The current is rectified to DC. The AC voltage has peak voltage equal to the DC value fed to the heater, so the value is about 80% of this (about 190V AC) and variable frequency so it’s not useful. The output is basically 240V DC. Actually variable DC voltage would maximise the performance, with lower voltage in lower winds, higher in higher winds.
It’s not easy to find an inverter that works well with input from a wind turbine, but the Sunsynk is supposed to do this. It might be necessary to keep the existing heating controller in place to protect the Sunsynk inverter from excessive voltage that the turbine might produce when unloaded. The inverter needs to be programmed with values for the best performance of the windmill. As a default you could simply enter the voltage the heater has been working at. You might be able to coax more power in low winds using a lower voltage and in high winds higher but it’s not easy to say exactly how much lower and higher. The data is entered in the form of a table to the inverter settings. There is a web interface you can use for monitoring and configuring the inverter. It also has batteries and the ability to activate a dump load for excess power."
Any comments in light of this additional information would be welcomed. Thanks!

[openspaceman]

Why can't a smart MPPT charger maximise the variable output and charge a 48V battery?

The victron 150-60 would do I think but a bit expensive.

[Marcus]

You seem to have several options available : sunsynk, windyboy for a.c. coupling, or a programmable mppt for d c. Charging a battery- i think midnite solar or morningstar do an mppt with a programmable curve - i don't know about victron. But it would need to be an mppt with a high input voltage tolerance if the nominal voltage of the turbine is 240v.

Either way you need to have something to limit the input voltage:- if running unloaded, it will output much more than 240v, and wind turbines don't like running unloaded (although the proven has more tolerance for this than most wind turbines). As hugh piggott says, the existing controller may be able to be repurposed for this. Depending on what system you eventually go with you ought to have a destination for excess power to go, rather than let the turbine run unloaded.

At some point you need to decide which way you want to go? Grid connected, i would assume, but do you want a battery? Do you want a system that keeps going if the grid goes down (needs a battery)? Do you want to be able to export to the grid? And get paid for it (MCS installer reqd)?

[Heroformosa]

Thanks Marcus. The original set up with the WT was that the power went into an immersion heater in a 2m³ water tank, along with a wet solar and ASHP. If the tank temp got too high then a diverter on the Proven Controller kicked in and the the power went to space heating, so the turbine didn't run unloaded. I'm not sure if that diverter could still function in a new setup if it could be triggered by full batteries, if the Proven Controller was left in place as Hugh Piggott suggests.
Do I want a battery? I'd assumed so! The WT is not MCS approved, so I can't export onto the grid from that, but I assume that an MCS approved battery set up (taking power from a non-MCS turbine) would allow that. I'd assumed I would discharge the battery into the ASHP and PHEV, and top it up from a low tariff mains contract...and sell back to the grid at high tariff if possible. As for providing a supply in the event of a grid failure, though I live on the far NW coast of Scotland our grid is fairly robust (it gets regularly stress-tested!) and power cuts are pretty few and far between - and we've learned to live with them, so it's not a priority.

[Ken]

My understanding from backalong was that one needs to feed the turbine into a battery in order to provide a load to prevent overspeed and to stabalise the voltage as this can vary a huge amount. Need to check.

With the batt you then have the freedom to do whatever you fancy. If you think you might want to export then fitting PV will make that possible.

[MikeNovack]

My understanding from backalong was that one needs to feed the turbine into a battery in order to provide a load to prevent overspeed and to stabalise the voltage as this can vary a huge amount. Need to check.

With the batt you then have the freedom to do whatever you fancy. If you think you might want to export then fitting PV will make that possible.

Well, since the power in wind goes with the CUBE of the wind speed, preventing over speed of a wind turbine can't simply be by putting more power into a battery. That works only with wind velocities lower than some amount and until battery full. The two ways HAWTs can use is changing the axis of rotation so not aligned with the wind (in which case they stop -- it's what Aeromotors have done since 1888). Or by changing the pitch to lower the tip speed to wind speed ratio (and also at a low tip speed to wind ratio, the""solidity" is reduced --- two or three narrow blades might have high solidity at a tip/wind >6 but low at <2 ---- why those Aeromotors are almost solid with many blades)

IN THEORY a fixed blade HAWT could regulate by axis change and still be producing power if it had two rotors at the ends of a beam. The beam rotates to align with the wind. The hub of each prop can rotate on the beam to be aligned with the wind or any other angle up to 90 degrees off << two rotors so the forces from their being not aligned can cancel >> The Aeromotors can instead use a simpler method as in their intended application never called upon to keep generating in too high winds << as the wind speed increased, surely managed to completely fill the stock tank to overflowing before "snapping" off.

PS -- I know how an Aeromotor snaps "off" but not how the mechanism works to unsnap it back "on" when the wind speed backs down.

The VAWTs are different. A Savonius needs a powerful brake as the type has high torque even at zero speed. A Darrieus just needs a brake to slow it down to below a speed/wind ratio of ~4 since it will stall. That's why the Darrieus type is usually not self starting. If not turning, stalled regardless of wind speed.

[Gareth J]

Thanks Marcus. The original set up with the WT was that the power went into an immersion heater in a 2m³ water tank, along with a wet solar and ASHP. If the tank temp got too high then a diverter on the Proven Controller kicked in and the the power went to space heating, so the turbine didn't run unloaded. I'm not sure if that diverter could still function in a new setup if it could be triggered by full batteries, if the Proven Controller was left in place as Hugh Piggott suggests.
Do I want a battery? I'd assumed so! The WT is not MCS approved, so I can't export onto the grid from that, but I assume that an MCS approved battery set up (taking power from a non-MCS turbine) would allow that. I'd assumed I would discharge the battery into the ASHP and PHEV, and top it up from a low tariff mains contract...and sell back to the grid at high tariff if possible. As for providing a supply in the event of a grid failure, though I live on the far NW coast of Scotland our grid is fairly robust (it gets regularly stress-tested!) and power cuts are pretty few and far between - and we've learned to live with them, so it's not a priority.

Is the 2m^3 tank still a part of the heating system? Or can it be? If so, with that and your EV, there probably isn't a great deal of use for an electric battery. if you also get an MCS registered solar setup, so you can also export and be paid for it, could be a relatively cheap solution with very good savings.

[Gareth J]

Another quick thought, unless you are very mechanically savvy, and have time to spare for tinkering with the turbine, it might be wise to look at it as an added bonus, rather than an integral part of any system. They do require maintenance and potentially expensive rebuilds too. If it sitting idle and otherwise works, it is definitely crying out to be put to work. But it just may not work faultlessly for that long.