Starting out on my heat pump journey

[Yuff]

Think plumber made a dogs dinner of my ashp’s installation in 2022.
Have been trying to get it to work efficiently ever since.
Original installer messed up the grant application so missed out but plumber who came to look at the installation is confident he can rectify everything and OFGEM have said as long as I have an EPC showing a gas boiler I should be ok for the grant.
Hoping I can swap 2 8.5 kw ashp’s for a 14kw one which will make swmbo very happy

[Ronski]

Yuff, hopefully you can get it sorted, and get the grant.

Hopefully everything will go well on my install, but something usually doesn't get done properly when I get professionals in.

[Stinsy]

Think plumber made a dogs dinner of my ashp’s installation in 2022.
Have been trying to get it to work efficiently ever since.
Original installer messed up the grant application so missed out but plumber who came to look at the installation is confident he can rectify everything and OFGEM have said as long as I have an EPC showing a gas boiler I should be ok for the grant.
Hoping I can swap 2 8.5 kw ashp’s for a 14kw one which will make swmbo very happy

Have you seen "Urban Plumbers" on youtube?

He "fixes" bodged HP installations by removing low-loss headers, zone valve, additional pumps and simplifying the system. Basically a gas fitter reading the MCS guidelines (which faws over all the aforementioned gubbins) will never achieve a satisfactory install!

Are you sure you need a new 14kW HP? My guess is that one of your 8.5kW HPs could do the job, it just needs whatever problems are holding it back sorting out!

[Yuff]

Think plumber made a dogs dinner of my ashp’s installation in 2022.
Have been trying to get it to work efficiently ever since.
Original installer messed up the grant application so missed out but plumber who came to look at the installation is confident he can rectify everything and OFGEM have said as long as I have an EPC showing a gas boiler I should be ok for the grant.
Hoping I can swap 2 8.5 kw ashp’s for a 14kw one which will make swmbo very happy

Have you seen "Urban Plumbers" on youtube?

He "fixes" bodged HP installations by removing low-loss headers, zone valve, additional pumps and simplifying the system. Basically a gas fitter reading the MCS guidelines (which faws over all the aforementioned gubbins) will never achieve a satisfactory install!

Are you sure you need a new 14kW HP? My guess is that one of your 8.5kW HPs could do the job, it just needs whatever problems are holding it back sorting out!

No I haven’t seen the YouTube.
However the plumber who visited Friday said there was so much wrong with the system and even basic stuff like lagging pipe work etc wasn’t done properly, that alone he said, would make a huge difference to the efficiency of our system.
He seemed pretty knowledgeable and he was recommended by Mitsubishi.
The house is almost 100 years old and 4000 sq ft, reasonably insulated, and swmbo likes the house pretty toasty, so I think 8.5 kw ashp might be pushing it.
But it’s just nice to find someone who is bothered and gets all the import export stuff.previous plumber I tried 3 times to lag the pipe work on his 3rd visit after saying the useless polystyrene lagging was sufficient he said you can get the black purpose lagging ( don’t know the correct name) which i can for but dont have any with me or you can go to b&q and pick some up

[Fintray]

But it’s just nice to find someone who is bothered and gets all the import export stuff.previous plumber I tried 3 times to lag the pipe work on his 3rd visit after saying the useless polystyrene lagging was sufficient he said you can get the black purpose lagging ( don’t know the correct name) which i can for but dont have any with me or you can go to b&q and pick some up

It could be Armaflex that you are thinking of.

[Stinsy]

I really would advise fixing the problems rather than ripping out and starting over. Sure your guy might be highly skilled, but his interests lie in selling you a new HP. I really think that simplifying and/or upsizing a few pipe runs, removing any low-loss-header, zone valve or supplementary pump, and sorting the lagging will fix the problems. Pipe lagging is super easy to fix. Buy yourself a few boxes of K-Flex and get on it! The process is very rewarding and a plumber will never have the time to get everything perfect like you will.

Obviously, I don't know the ins and outs of your house. 4000sq ft is pretty big (about 370m² compared to a typical 3-bed semi is 100m²) and you're probably somewhere in the 20-40W/m² range so a single 8.5kW ASHP might do the job on its own if you are very well insulated but is going to be borderline. However supplementary heating such as a WBS or A2A or even resistive will add some heating capacity on the very coldest days.

[SimonSays]

But it’s just nice to find someone who is bothered and gets all the import export stuff.previous plumber I tried 3 times to lag the pipe work on his 3rd visit after saying the useless polystyrene lagging was sufficient he said you can get the black purpose lagging ( don’t know the correct name) which i can for but dont have any with me or you can go to b&q and pick some up

It could be Armaflex that you are thinking of.

Primary Pro is the one that Urban Plumbers seem to like.

[Yuff]

But it’s just nice to find someone who is bothered and gets all the import export stuff.previous plumber I tried 3 times to lag the pipe work on his 3rd visit after saying the useless polystyrene lagging was sufficient he said you can get the black purpose lagging ( don’t know the correct name) which i can for but dont have any with me or you can go to b&q and pick some up

It could be Armaflex that you are thinking of.

Armaflex rings a bell

[Yuff]

I really would advise fixing the problems rather than ripping out and starting over. Sure your guy might be highly skilled, but his interests lie in selling you a new HP. I really think that simplifying and/or upsizing a few pipe runs, removing any low-loss-header, zone valve or supplementary pump, and sorting the lagging will fix the problems. Pipe lagging is super easy to fix. Buy yourself a few boxes of K-Flex and get on it! The process is very rewarding and a plumber will never have the time to get everything perfect like you will.

Obviously, I don't know the ins and outs of your house. 4000sq ft is pretty big (about 370m² compared to a typical 3-bed semi is 100m²) and you're probably somewhere in the 20-40W/m² range so a single 8.5kW ASHP might do the job on its own if you are very well insulated but is going to be borderline. However supplementary heating such as a WBS or A2A or even resistive will add some heating capacity on the very coldest days.

I asked him if replacing the system and doing all the pipe work he needs to amend would it come in under £10k so I would supplement the work with £2.5kand he thought that would easily do it.
I’m then thinking I have two 8.5 kw heat pumps, with 2 1/2 years warranty on them, I might be able to sell for £3k ( maybe too optimistic)but if I can come out of it with an all singing and dancing 1 pump system it’s worth the hassle.
SWMBO would pay 2.5k to lose a heat pump

[Joeboy]

I really would advise fixing the problems rather than ripping out and starting over. Sure your guy might be highly skilled, but his interests lie in selling you a new HP. I really think that simplifying and/or upsizing a few pipe runs, removing any low-loss-header, zone valve or supplementary pump, and sorting the lagging will fix the problems. Pipe lagging is super easy to fix. Buy yourself a few boxes of K-Flex and get on it! The process is very rewarding and a plumber will never have the time to get everything perfect like you will.

Obviously, I don't know the ins and outs of your house. 4000sq ft is pretty big (about 370m² compared to a typical 3-bed semi is 100m²) and you're probably somewhere in the 20-40W/m² range so a single 8.5kW ASHP might do the job on its own if you are very well insulated but is going to be borderline. However supplementary heating such as a WBS or A2A or even resistive will add some heating capacity on the very coldest days.

My thoughts exactly.