Hybrit delivers first steel made using hydrogen.

[Mart]

*Lastly, on the subject of weight, the TM3 LR is approx 1,847kg, whilst the Toyota Mirai (HFCV) is approx 1,925kg.

You mean about 1.8 and 1.9 Tonnes respectively.
Whereas our current Meriva (which we use as little as possible) is about 1.5 Tonnes while our first mini was about 600kg, although nowhere near as as safe - for the driver and passengers anyway. Nowadays it's the other road users who suffer the impacts instead of course.

People just don't seem to be able to get it: overall energy use has to drop, and that means less personal transport, i.e less travelling overall. There are no special cases. Anybody see what Greta said, or does driving electric cars absolve people from responsibility for the climate catastrophe we are bequeathing to the next generation?
A

The issue being discussed was HFCV's and BEV's, and that HFCV's benefitted from being lighter, so I pointed out that a comparable BEV was actually lighter.

This has/had nothing to do with alternative forms of travel, or the decision to get a car or not.

Yes a Meriva weighs less, we had one for 9yrs, great car, but it will also consume many, many tonnes of FF's during its lifetime, emitting CO2, and local pollution for the current generation.



Also, when comparing an ICEV to a BEV (not that we were), it's worth considering all the mass that has to be extracted, shipped, refined, transported, and then wasted too:

Fossil fuel cars make 'hundreds of times' more waste than electric cars

Fossil fuel cars waste hundreds of times more raw material than their battery electric equivalents, according to a study that adds to evidence that the move away from petrol and diesel cars will bring large net environmental benefits.

Only about 30kg of raw material will be lost over the lifecycle of a lithium ion battery used in electric cars once recycling is taken into account, compared with 17,000 litres of oil, according to analysis by Transport & Environment (T&E) seen by the Guardian.

[AE-NMidlands]

All that is indeniably true, but I am hoping to replace my car by not actually having one. That will consume even less resources, and it would be brilliant if the city and suburban roads currently choked by parked cars could be freed up too.

I live in hope that the bus network will be rebuilt and services improved to the point where it is easy to do without one, and that there is a useable car club where I can get a vehicle for the few times a year I have to move beehives!

A

[Mart]

Totally true, and every car less will be a benefit, however that's a different argument to how BEV's & HFCV's compare to each other and as better alternatives to an ICE.

There is simply no argument for a 1.5t ICE that drives inefficiently, burns FF's and wastes all of its momentum via friction brakes, to a 1.8t BEV running on green leccy. [BTW my Ioniq BEV weighs about 1.4t. It's approx 50kg heavier than the petrol version, and 50kg lighter than the PHEV version.]

Where possible, take a car off the road, but for all the vehicles that can't be displaced, we need to move to cleaner BEV's asap.