camelot-forum.co.uk

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2022/ ... -power-use

I kept away from this piece initially but the value is "itemised" examples favoured over generic "atypical" reportage, for instance telly measured in normal vs 4k all the gubbins settings comparison, which presumably the reporter did himself rather than rip off "which"

It's a good effort, though. There is still a massive amount of misunderstanding about how much power everyday items use, and an even greater misunderstanding gap when it comes to how much energy they will use over a period of time, say a day, week, month or year, in normal use.

I've encountered this a lot over the past week or so, with people being worried about plugging things in because of the cost. Not just older people, either, if anything it's some of the younger people that don't have that good a grasp as to how much things really cost to use.

This has probably always been the case, but the big hikes in energy prices have really highlighted this in recent weeks, when combined with the cold weather.

I've been checking out various appliances simply by watching the smart meter while turning them on, a bit less precise than using an energy monitor plug but more convenient. Two things surprised me: Firstly, how little power LED lights use, I can light my entire house for about 50W (not that I do, but it's not worth fretting about not turning the "big light" on for example). Secondly, my fridge seems to have got its knickers in a twist yesterday and was consuming 500W! Something wrong there I suspect.

dangermouse wrote: ↑Tue Dec 13, 2022 3:12 pm I've been checking out various appliances simply by watching the smart meter while turning them on, a bit less precise than using an energy monitor plug but more convenient. Two things surprised me: Firstly, how little power LED lights use, I can light my entire house for about 50W (not that I do, but it's not worth fretting about not turning the "big light" on for example). Secondly, my fridge seems to have got its knickers in a twist yesterday and was consuming 500W! Something wrong there I suspect.

Defrost cycle?

Ha my wife has threatened our 5 year old that we will bill her is she leaves the lights on
She did one day I worked it out it was about 1.5 pence

My wife has always been paranoid about leaving lights on. Her father used to get angry with her every time she did it when she was small. I've tried explaining that the LED lights we have everywhere draw next to bugger all, but she still religiously goes around turning lights on and off, even if she's only going to be out of the room for a minute or two.

It's pretty dark outside at the moment and and I have the lights on here in my study. They are drawing the princely total of 16W, so about 0.3p per hour (the house is on battery power, so cheap rate electricity from last night, less losses). Mind you, every little saving helps, I just wonder if the wear and tear of turning them on and off outweighs the energy cost saving.

It's also all based on old data.

Swwils wrote: ↑Tue Dec 13, 2022 4:03 pm It's also all based on old data.

?? two months?? ..whilst the energy front has exploded of late, I don't think people will quibble too much at the age of the data costings, surely?
It gives insight, that & there's a lot of tariffs & times to plod through (a step too far) making it a dull read & likely beyond the understanding of those who are confused enough already.

..unless I'm missing something!? (highly possibility)

No, often they cite research that was performed before we had better power saving electronics and then it just gets regurgitated year on year.

Also, energy ratings are not calculated perfectly and are often "optimised". One test for the classification of a washing machine is 100 cycles on eco mode - a mode that many will not use because it doesn't wash a full load; similar for cookers where it heats to a 55C standard.

Also if you turn such devices off they no longer work so you might aswell not have the device.

In reality people need to weigh up getting rid of ancient electronics as those truly do waste energy. I had a 12 year old dell monitor that had silently failed and was using 400W in standby. It is often not economical to hold onto old goods, especially old fridges and freezers.

Swwils wrote: ↑Tue Dec 13, 2022 4:45 pm Also, energy ratings are not calculated perfectly and are often "optimised". One test for the classification of a washing machine is 100 cycles on eco mode - a mode that many will not use because it doesn't wash a full load; similar for cookers where it heats to a 55C standard.

I found a really good example of this, years ago. When building this house I first installed a hot water tank, that had a stated heat loss rate (and the appropriate efficiency rating label). Great, I thought, that means I can work out the heat loss per day easily.

Not true at all! It turned out that the measurement method used was some ancient British Standard that assumed a coal boiler fired up once (might have been twice) a day to heat the tank, so the family could take a bath. This test was done by cycling the tank. and the heat loss was the mean value between when the tank was hot and when it was cold, over a 24 hour period.

Anyway, if the tank was kept mostly hot, say by using an immersion run by excess PV generation as I was doing, the true heat loss rate was around three times higher than the label suggested. This is the reason I ripped it out and fitted the Sunamp thermal battery, as at least that has an honest number in the spec for the leat loss rate per 24 hours.

As always, the devil is in the detail, and it's very easy to get suckered into thinking things means something other than they really do.