Energy-intensive farming!

[AE-NMidlands]

shows a cow being airlifted off the alp by helicopter!
We have seen timber being extracted by helicopter there, which made me wonder about its carbon footprint. I have read that a lot of our forestry depends on fertiliser being broadcast by helicopter. Not good news!
A

[spread-tee]

Asw I understand it farmed ruminants in general are pretty bad news for the environment. To be sustainable we need to radically alter farming practices and our diet.

Spread

[Bugtownboy]

I wouldn’t accept farming ruminants is bad per se, it’s the intensive practices that are adopted to support fast food or cheap food.

Low intensity grazing has made the landscape/environment that we now strive to recreate - wild flower filled meadows for grazing or hay, small, hedged fields supporting wildlife etc.

It’s the greed of business, again, that has changed our relationship with ruminants - never grazed but fed high protein, probably GM, feed in ‘lots’, use of growth hormone, over use of antibiotics, selective breeding for early maturation/milk production.

I’m sure a return to lower intensity, responsible farming would be sustainable - the cost of beef would rise significantly if this was to be profitable, though.

I can accept that, if it meant I had a good quality steak once every three months and reduced my dairy intake.

[spread-tee]

I'd accept that at some level of production red meat is sustainable, but it is a horribly inefficient way of creating protien both from a land use and carbon point of view. Like you I could get by with red meat on a now and again basis, but to give up completely would be hard.

Deps

[Mr Gus]

Your argument doesn't show the whole picture, this was an injured cow, the rest walking off by themselves.
Helicopters buzz up & down alpine valley's all day long winter & summer, likely this was a return run & good practise (keeping sharp) maybe a return run from taking winter prep gear up, or maintenance kit, anything.

You could question therefore in another thread why they don't walk the solar panel installs up to the lake themselves, as the added carbon footprint doesn't help any (etc).

We also rarely question why a hill walker is airlifted off a mountain (again injury, or sometimes human idiocy) & that one will be called out for the purpose, a farmer may simply telephone in & say I need help can I have 5 minutes of airtime, none of that is clear.


It's not like whole herds are flown too & fro & disingenuous to suggest by the title & still frame to imply that may be the case.

Rather than misleadingly title the thread do some groundwork if this heli-lift rankles you so much & tell us just how intensive a cow in summer grazing (usually walked up & down) & likely overwintered in a traditional small herd alpine byre is compared to our own modern industrialised farming with its energy intense concrete yard scraping, & slurry tanks, daily milk tanker pick up type operation.

[Paul_F]

Rather than misleadingly title the thread do some groundwork if this heli-lift rankles you so much & tell us just how intensive a cow in summer grazing (usually walked up & down) & likely overwintered in a traditional small herd alpine byre is compared to our own modern industrialised farming with its energy intense concrete yard scraping, & slurry tanks, daily milk tanker pick up type operation.

That's something that gets missed a lot. Beef farming carbon footprint calculations are heavily influenced by US Feedlot operations - intensively farmed cattle fed on imported soybeans or irrigated maize. Grass fed is rather lower, but there is a limit to how much is feasible per capita since it needs a lot of grass.

[Stan]

If I’m not mistaken it’s a Brown Swiss. It certainly was when it landed.

[Stinsy]

Rather than misleadingly title the thread do some groundwork if this heli-lift rankles you so much & tell us just how intensive a cow in summer grazing (usually walked up & down) & likely overwintered in a traditional small herd alpine byre is compared to our own modern industrialised farming with its energy intense concrete yard scraping, & slurry tanks, daily milk tanker pick up type operation.

That's something that gets missed a lot. Beef farming carbon footprint calculations are heavily influenced by US Feedlot operations - intensively farmed cattle fed on imported soybeans or irrigated maize. Grass fed is rather lower, but there is a limit to how much is feasible per capita since it needs a lot of grass.

I’ve read that pastured beef is carbon negative…

It is hard to find accurate information because you have very well-funded groups aggressively pushing missinformation in both directions.

[Paul_F]

I’ve read that pastured beef is carbon negative…

It is hard to find accurate information because you have very well-funded groups aggressively pushing missinformation in both directions.

It's definitely possible - see for instance http://brownsranch.us (he's got a load of good videos on youtube) - inputs are seeds and a little bit of diesel, and the soil carbon is clearly going up a lot so I think it's hard to argue he isn't carbon-negative. There are limits to how far you can scale up though.

[Bugtownboy]

C’mon guys.

Destroying the Amazon rain forest to produce beef for burgers, producing hormone enhanced beef in feed lots, feeding GM soy to said cattle that are antibiotic supported all in the pursuit of fast food

Beef production internationally is an industrial process.

It is not sustainable.

Beef can be produced sustainably and responsibly - it will require a massive change in behaviour. As will anything we need to do to achieve any semblance of responsible resource use.