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burning forest
Posted: Thu Dec 16, 2021 10:08 pm
by billi
Is burning biomass imported , from somewhere not a complete greenwash and just a fast but criminal way to lower Co2 emissions statistics ?
https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Dom ... _327472309
Re: burning forest
Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2021 12:12 am
by Joeboy
What do you think in the place you live Billi? Genuine question. How goes it?
My knowledge of biomass sites are limited to either on gb status site gauge or one biomass gen site I know of about 10 miles from my home. They have piles of timber stacked for processing and it doesn't go to landfill. Power grabbed now rather than later?
Be clear on your point please so we can learn? Or at least compare. Of course trees are the new coal. So am I given time.
Re: burning forest
Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2021 1:57 am
by billi
Well Joeboy ,
I try to be as genuine as possible
i guess i have to start about 18 years back , when i was lying under my Diesel pick up truck to install a thicker fuelpipe and a heatexchanger to run the car on veggie oil , the conversion kit costed not much about 300 Euro , and at the time there was an Irish supplier that granted me to supply Rapeseed oil grown and pressed in Ireland , when i finally managed to drive around on 100 % Vegetable oil in Co.Cork Ireland , and people could smell and smile about me .... i was told that that company just supplies veggie oil to people who have a garage conversion done , That company went bust soon , but i , at the time liked that idea of growing rape , press oil out of it and feed the biggest/rest part of the plant to animals .... as an alternative to a petrol station ....
But back to the subject and that is the tricky part , to lower Co2 emission it is a welcome strategy to burn biomass instead of coal , but biomass from where ? So simple Greenwash to cut down forests in America/Canada feed the woodpellets in the EU or UK power plants to greenwasch the emissions ? So by importing biomass we basically buy a credit to not pay for dirty power production , but to deforrest other countries and leave a desert ...
As a result, the UK has become the world’s largest wood pellet importer, with a 28% share of the global market (graphic, top centre). It imported 3.9 million tonnes in 2013, an estimated 4.6 million tonnes in 2014 and is expected to import 5.5 million tonnes this year.
https://www.carbonbrief.org/investigati ... ate-change
the use of Biomass should be honest , and take a part in the energy mix as we need , not exploided as an imported idea , to just fuel wood into coal fired plants from abroad is a wrong method
Re: burning forest
Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2021 5:57 am
by Stinsy
I remember reading somewhere that in North America the CO2 credit is applied when the trees are felled, whereas in the UK the credit is applied when the wood is burned. So the carbon saving is counted twice.
In any case, how is the biomass felled, processed, and transported? I wonder how much ff is employed to get each tonne of pellets to Drax?
Re: burning forest
Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2021 8:45 am
by Joeboy
billi wrote: ↑Fri Dec 17, 2021 1:57 am
Well Joeboy ,
I try to be as genuine as possible
i guess i have to start about 18 years back , when i was lying under my Diesel pick up truck to install a thicker fuelpipe and a heatexchanger to run the car on veggie oil , the conversion kit costed not much about 300 Euro , and at the time there was an Irish supplier that granted me to supply Rapeseed oil grown and pressed in Ireland , when i finally managed to drive around on 100 % Vegetable oil in Co.Cork Ireland , and people could smell and smile about me .... i was told that that company just supplies veggie oil to people who have a garage conversion done , That company went bust soon , but i , at the time liked that idea of growing rape , press oil out of it and feed the biggest/rest part of the plant to animals .... as an alternative to a petrol station ....
But back to the subject and that is the tricky part , to lower Co2 emission it is a welcome strategy to burn biomass instead of coal , but biomass from where ? So simple Greenwash to cut down forests in America/Canada feed the woodpellets in the EU or UK power plants to greenwasch the emissions ? So by importing biomass we basically buy a credit to not pay for dirty power production , but to deforrest other countries and leave a desert ...
As a result, the UK has become the world’s largest wood pellet importer, with a 28% share of the global market (graphic, top centre). It imported 3.9 million tonnes in 2013, an estimated 4.6 million tonnes in 2014 and is expected to import 5.5 million tonnes this year.
https://www.carbonbrief.org/investigati ... ate-change
the use of Biomass should be honest , and take a part in the energy mix as we need , not exploided as an imported idea , to just fuel wood into coal fired plants from abroad is a wrong method
Nice story on the oil. I used a 60/40 mix on my 2 month run around Europe in my mazda bongo. Loved that smell. Shocking on the carbon credits and import of felled biomass as pellets. That's a sneaky, scurrilous practice.
I actually feel sick that this goes on while WT curtailment exists at the same time. Surely this is an reason for move grid storage capacity?
Re: burning forest
Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2021 10:10 am
by AE-NMidlands
Joeboy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 17, 2021 8:45 am
I actually feel sick that this goes on while WT curtailment exists at the same time. Surely this is an reason for move grid storage capacity?
Me too. I wrote to my MP and he ignored it, which reminds me I must poke him to see if I can even get a reply.
Re: burning forest
Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2021 10:14 am
by Joeboy
AE-NMidlands wrote: ↑Fri Dec 17, 2021 10:10 am
Joeboy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 17, 2021 8:45 am
I actually feel sick that this goes on while WT curtailment exists at the same time. Surely this is an reason for move grid storage capacity?
Me too. I wrote to my MP and he ignored it, which reminds me I must poke him to see if I can even get a reply.
A sharp stick is traditional?
Re: burning forest
Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2021 1:13 pm
by billi
Hey Joeboy ,
...one day in my area in West Cork ,Ireland .... a local fish and chip shop owner , sat beside me , and have me about 400 kg of used veggie oil
Sure i was the crazy German driving on chipper oil at the time ....
So that chipper shop man told me that he had to pay for getting his oil collected by a certain company that i rang the next day , and they told me that i can not buy that waste vegetable oil ........ cause the Germans bought it all ... what a laugh that was at the time
So that used veggie oil was shipped to get refined and added into fuelstation diesel pumps what we call "Biodiesel" here in Germany ( sure other ideas are involved too)
so simplyfyed words ..... first to buy 1 liter of veggie oil is 1 Euro imported to Ireland , getting rid of it after use is 0.5 Euro profit to export from Ireland , so basically that local company told me , that they (company in west coast Ireland) wont sell me used veggi oil, as it all goes to Germany
Re: burning forest
Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2021 1:55 pm
by Ken
After reading that carbon brief report i am left with the following thoughts,
1)US pellet exports to the UK are large, perhaps 3.5 million tonnes this year, according to a January 2015 report from the US Department of Agriculture Foreign Agricultural Service. But they remain small compared to the 320 million tonnes of wood harvested from US forests each year. This total is, in turn, around 30% below harvest levels seen in the 1990s, the report says, while 98 pulp or paper plants closed in the US between 1998 and 2003.
2) How much wood burns in those large forest fires
3) What would happen to all the wood waste from construction industry etc if not burnt -create methane?
4) now we have the collapse of news print my understanding is that there is a surplus of wood in Europe.
Re: burning forest
Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2021 2:18 pm
by dan_b
You may be interested to know that Peter Bottomley MP has today written to the Government, with a cross-party backing of 50 other MPs, calling on it to end the subsidies provided to Drax for burning wood pellets and reclassifying it not to be a renewable low carbon fuel.
https://www.sirpeterbottomley.com/biomass-energy