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Re: iD4
Posted: Sun Jul 25, 2021 5:15 pm
by Mr Gus
Whilst we only picked ours up in March 2021 the wifes car heater usage is like that of a normal persons in deep winter, & bearing in mind all the glass on the Tesla 3 it hasn't seemed to have made a dent in battery state of charge, which bearing in mind her monthly mileage (so far 6500 miles since pick up) I can detect no alarming anomalies related to power spaffing!
(Even in HOT weather like we've just had she keeps it set at 21.5c ..at the lowest 20c when flushing the car from sitting in the sun)
Re: iD4
Posted: Mon Jul 26, 2021 10:32 am
by Oliver90owner
I look on the larger battery as a plus. I still run with full size spare wheels on both our cars. BEVs, driven sensibly, get back a lot of what it takes to drag the heavier battery up hills - not like a spare wheel on an ICE vehicle.
Also ~80kWh, if only generally used between 80 and 20% SOC, equates to around a recharge every 150 miles - if not able to charge at home.
Most cars, beyond the bottom of the range, are now fitted with air-con these days - so what is so special about fitting a heat pump in a BEV? It should be standard or dirt cheap, compared to the extra costs (at time of purchase) raked in by the manufacturers/ dealers.
Re: iD4
Posted: Mon Jul 26, 2021 11:38 am
by dan_b
That big lump of fossil combustion up front provides so much waste heat so OEMs have never had to think about using a heat pump to provide efficient cabin heating and traction battery heat management in an ICE car.
Watching the Sandy Munro teardown comparison of the HVAC systems in the Model Y vs the Ford Mach-E is an eye-opening case in point.
Although interestingly enough Tesla only recently brought heat pumps to their BEVs too.
Re: iD4
Posted: Mon Jul 26, 2021 12:11 pm
by Mr Gus
Oliver90owner wrote: ↑Mon Jul 26, 2021 10:32 am
Also ~80kWh, if only generally used between 80 and 20% SOC, equates to around a recharge every 150 miles - if not able to charge at home.
Most cars, beyond the bottom of the range, are now fitted with air-con these days - so what is so special about fitting a heat pump in a BEV? It should be standard or dirt cheap, compared to the extra costs (at time of purchase) raked in by the manufacturers/ dealers.
They may not do 150 miles per week, most weeks, therefore battery sizing not the biggest issue.
The tesla sales model keeps it simple & standardised, remember oliver that different sellers / manufs have different perceptions of tiers of comfort & therefore upsell.
If a manufacturer hasn't taken note of older nissan leafs with hat pumps fitted (working well) then what the hell have they learnt at all of BEV's?
An ASHP should be standard, but if you are switching out your stock from ICE to bev then there is going to be a lot of pre-existing bolt-ons you have in stock as part of a manufacturing / buying agreement to price gouge production & profit, the manuf may try to palm off till contractural stock is empty after all accountants seem to have the last word on design.
The improvement of a heat pump over a wire element should be obvious to all & a pre-requisite in BEV manufacture, not something you pay thousands extra for as a luxury tier compared to what it would cost to add one to your home which gets far more use.
Re: iD4
Posted: Mon Jul 26, 2021 2:26 pm
by Stinsy
Mr Gus wrote: ↑Mon Jul 26, 2021 12:11 pm
Oliver90owner wrote: ↑Mon Jul 26, 2021 10:32 am
Also ~80kWh, if only generally used between 80 and 20% SOC, equates to around a recharge every 150 miles - if not able to charge at home.
Most cars, beyond the bottom of the range, are now fitted with air-con these days - so what is so special about fitting a heat pump in a BEV? It should be standard or dirt cheap, compared to the extra costs (at time of purchase) raked in by the manufacturers/ dealers.
They may not do 150 miles per week, most weeks, therefore battery sizing not the biggest issue.
The tesla sales model keeps it simple & standardised, remember oliver that different sellers / manufs have different perceptions of tiers of comfort & therefore upsell.
If a manufacturer hasn't taken note of older nissan leafs with hat pumps fitted (working well) then what the hell have they learnt at all of BEV's?
An ASHP should be standard, but if you are switching out your stock from ICE to bev then there is going to be a lot of pre-existing bolt-ons you have in stock as part of a manufacturing / buying agreement to price gouge production & profit, the manuf may try to palm off till contractural stock is empty after all accountants seem to have the last word on design.
The improvement of a heat pump over a wire element should be obvious to all & a pre-requisite in BEV manufacture, not something you pay thousands extra for as a luxury tier compared to what it would cost to add one to your home which gets far more use.
I agree all BEVs should come with a heat pump as standard. But it comes down to what a manufacturer can get away with charging extra for. £1000 is a ridiculous amount to charge but clearly people will pay it. Notably only the very highest trim level if iD4 comes with a HP as standard so they are using it to push people into taking the highest "Max" trim level.
We have been stuck for 4hrs in a traffic jam on the motorway in -10℃ weather with kids in the car. The heat pump gives peace of mind that our range wouldn't be dropping fast if we where in that situation in a BEV. Also I'd be annoyed at a resistive heater chugging away at the mains lead while tethered to the house! I'd be much happier preheating the car with a heat pump even when battery range isn't a consideration.
Re: iD4
Posted: Mon Jul 26, 2021 4:00 pm
by Mr Gus
& they will Stinsy, whilst the buying public is more concerned with "top gear" type performance rather then day to day realities.
Personally would make a lazy sales guy work hard for the cash & state the obvious, that the Heat Pump price is WAY OVER MARKET NORM & something needs a price correction there if you are expected to buy..vs walk away.
But many folk have not a clue what a heat pump is nor does, given the simplicity of the two words / 4 if stated properly.
Re: iD4
Posted: Fri Mar 10, 2023 7:28 am
by Stinsy
Stinsy wrote: ↑Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:48 pm
Finally ordered one. Have been talking about it for at least 6 months. VW have managed to make battery-size, motor power, and trim level unnecessarily complicated. But in the end I went for: Pro Performance Max (Big battery, mid power, 2WD, most of the toys).
Lead times are a bit silly, it is a 50:50 shot as to whether I get it before Xmas or not...
Anyone else on here got one?
So, update for you all. I know most of you have been following this thread with baited breath, but for those of you that haven’t: VW didn’t manage to deliver the car by Xmas 2021. They missed Xmas 2022 as well. However it has now landed at the docks and I should have it in a week or two.
I have to say VW have been a shitshow. Worse than the ridiculous amount of time it has taken from order to delivery has been the constant setting and missing of deadlines. I’ve lost track of how many “scheduled manufacturer dates” were set and missed. The dealership (JCB Medway) have been poor too, with zero proactive communication from them and every update has taken several emails and voicemails to get any information.
Just hope I like the car after all this!
Re: iD4
Posted: Fri Mar 10, 2023 7:46 am
by Joeboy
Stinsy wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 7:28 am
Stinsy wrote: ↑Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:48 pm
Finally ordered one. Have been talking about it for at least 6 months. VW have managed to make battery-size, motor power, and trim level unnecessarily complicated. But in the end I went for: Pro Performance Max (Big battery, mid power, 2WD, most of the toys).
Lead times are a bit silly, it is a 50:50 shot as to whether I get it before Xmas or not...
Anyone else on here got one?
So, update for you all. I know most of you have been following this thread with baited breath, but for those of you that haven’t: VW didn’t manage to deliver the car by Xmas 2021. They missed Xmas 2022 as well. However it has now landed at the docks and I should have it in a week or two.
I have to say VW have been a shitshow. Worse than the ridiculous amount of time it has taken from order to delivery has been the constant setting and missing of deadlines. I’ve lost track of how many “scheduled manufacturer dates” were set and missed. The dealership (JCB Medway” have been poor too, with zero proactive communication from them and every update has taken several emails and voicemails to get any information.
Just hope I like the car after all this!
Going on VW's plastic view of time (and diesel), just through the gate in time for Autumn! I hope you enjoy it, congratulations.
Looking forward to seeing it. Aye, ye did press confirm when you placed the order?
Imagine! (Sorry)..
Re: iD4
Posted: Fri Mar 10, 2023 9:07 am
by Yuff
Don’t worry Porsche aren’t much better.
Ordered Dec21
Should have been ready for collection Mar 1st, last week.
Taycan recall for heat pumps so sitting in a warehouse in Germany waiting for the part
Re: iD4
Posted: Fri Mar 10, 2023 9:36 am
by Mr Gus
Sounds like spares are going to be a massive problem if & when you need them.
Dire.