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If there is a foul wind a blowin' then drop by for a chat - about coconuts of anything else off topic.
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AE-NMidlands
Posts: 1714
Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2021 6:10 pm

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#1

Post by AE-NMidlands »

How is this for sending to a complete novice who has asked for advice?
Solar pv panels were initially very expensive and not very efficient (by modern standards) so installation was encouraged by the govt. who “gave” a generous subsidy (“FIT”) to “buy” half of people's notional output (i.e. assuming people would manage to consume 50% of their output.) This was before much in the way of sophisticated metering.
Then smart meters started to become effective and export meters or meter registers came available, so export tariffs developed.
At the same time, batteries and controllers/inverters were developed which allowed storage of surplus PV, so that people could avoid grid import some or most of the year, by storing surplus daytime generation for later / overnight use.

Nowadays almost any combination of generation/import/export is available if you can find the right tariff: Generate as much as you like, store as much as you like, export as much as you like (within what your local network will accept) import at low rates in the small hours, export at peak rates in the early evening, the list is endless (almost every possible option is possible!)
You might import at plunge (or even negative) rates in the small hours to charge a battery and then sell it back at peak rates early in the evening – gaining from the arbitrage each day – again if you are on a suitable tariff and if you don't lose more by battery round trip losses! So your batteries can earn a return to help cover the investment even in the winter when there is no significant solar pv income, besides letting you run the house off cheap-rate electricity imported during the small hours.
2.0 kW/4.62 MWhr pa in Ripples, 4.5 kWp W-facing pv, 9.5 kWhr batt
30 solar thermal tubes, 2MWhr pa in Stockport, plus Congleton and Kinlochbervie Hydros,
Most travel by bike, walking or bus/train. Veg, fruit - and Bees!
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Joeboy
Posts: 6739
Joined: Mon May 31, 2021 4:22 pm
Location: Inverurie

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#2

Post by Joeboy »

AE-NMidlands wrote: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:34 pm How is this for sending to a complete novice who has asked for advice?
Solar pv panels were initially very expensive and not very efficient (by modern standards) so installation was encouraged by the govt. who “gave” a generous subsidy (“FIT”) to “buy” half of people's notional output (i.e. assuming people would manage to consume 50% of their output.) This was before much in the way of sophisticated metering.
Then smart meters started to become effective and export meters or meter registers came available, so export tariffs developed.
At the same time, batteries and controllers/inverters were developed which allowed storage of surplus PV, so that people could avoid grid import some or most of the year, by storing surplus daytime generation for later / overnight use.

Nowadays almost any combination of generation/import/export is available if you can find the right tariff: Generate as much as you like, store as much as you like, export as much as you like (within what your local network will accept) import at low rates in the small hours, export at peak rates in the early evening, the list is endless (almost every possible option is possible!)
You might import at plunge (or even negative) rates in the small hours to charge a battery and then sell it back at peak rates early in the evening – gaining from the arbitrage each day – again if you are on a suitable tariff and if you don't lose more by battery round trip losses! So your batteries can earn a return to help cover the investment even in the winter when there is no significant solar pv income, besides letting you run the house off cheap-rate electricity imported during the small hours.
Too much you think? We aren't looking to dumb down, too much of that goes on in the wider world. Gear up, learn, crack on! Stuck? Ask. No such thing as a stupid question. :)

Internet is weird, it is an apparently even playing field where all spoutings are equal. Not true of course, never dumb down (heinous term) until the third or so go through, then fair enough. Just my NSHO. :oops:

Did this offshore for years, developed a theory over decades. Goes like this "if you hold your hand out, lift them up. Don't hold them down". Simple as anything yet it dropped like a hammer onto me when I twigged to it. I do the same nowadays but combine the "lift them up" bit with not dumbing down.

P.S Dumb f**k here, still learning. :D :facepalm:
15.8kW PV SE, VI & DW
Ripple 7kW WT & Gen to date 11MWh
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12kWh 210ltr HWT.
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John_S
Posts: 317
Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2021 10:03 am
Location: West London

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#3

Post by John_S »

You underplay the reduction of the cost of installations as panel and inverter prices decreased and efficiency of installers increased. Well before the FIT ended, some on the other place had posted that Solar PV was economic without FIT.

That was all several years before energy supplier caught on that export was worth paying more for than the deemed 50% tariff,

Back in 2009, I responded to a consultation with the comment that the export price should be the price of the energy suppliers highest tariff less, say, a 5pence margin. Forget all the distribution and admin cost and green levy carp. The electricity was just going next door.

Funny how no one listened to me.
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