Extreme Gridwatch Events Winter 2022/23

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Joeboy
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Re: Extreme Gridwatch Events Winter 2022/23

#51

Post by Joeboy »

hoggy wrote: Tue Nov 29, 2022 3:16 pm Right this is a bit of a crash course in the Balancing system so here goes.
Generation (& to an extent demand but not going into that) can participate in the balancing system but to do so they need to supply a constant stream of data (in half hour chunks) as to: What their Import Capacity is (MIL), Export Capacity (MEL), and ACTUAL(FPN) import/export power flow is in that period.
This all gets fed into National Grid/Elexon who can then see who's doing what, where & how much is available to allow them to make decisions - "you need to increase output, you need to lower output" to keep everything in balance (Load vs Demand) - you can see how good (or bad) they are doing with this lever pulling by what the grid frequency is (<50Hz Demand exceeding Supply : >50Hz Supply exceeding demand)

There's more to it than that but we'll be here all day: The good part about all this is that you now have a juicy data source. What I (Terravolt) do is pull all this info in & make it far more user friendly than what the Grid use (it's all hidden behind grid codes and not user friendly: Whitelee Battery is under the name: T_WHLWB-1 which yes doesn't take a genius to work out but that's an easy one.)

So if you pull up the stream for this one location: Here & then click the "Physical" button you should get a graph of all of yesterday.

You'll see it had an Export Limit (Green Line - MEL) of 50MW Max at the start. So upto 50MW can be called upon.
Import Limit (Light Blue - MIL) of 36MW until about 12:30pm (it charged for about half an hour (FPN went negative) & then MIL went to about 0 suggesting it was perhaps full.)
Power Flow (Purple Line - FPN) of 40MW from 17:00 to 18:00 (so 40MWh discharged)
MEL plummets to 0. Suggesting the battery is empty and is no longer able to supply anything to the grid. (Curiously MIL stayed 0 so perhaps it has to cool down or something.)
Nice one, thank you for that. Akin to a curtain twitch in Oz. :D

I will dive in with a morning cuppa. 👏
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nowty
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Re: Extreme Gridwatch Events Winter 2022/23

#52

Post by nowty »

Not much capacity left on the interconnectors. I think we still have another 3 GW of demand to come, notwithstanding the England World cup game interference.

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Stinsy
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Re: Extreme Gridwatch Events Winter 2022/23

#53

Post by Stinsy »

What is the impact of the football match?

Will factories shut down and therefore reduce demand?
Will millions od fridges opening every few mins to get beer out increase demand?
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Oldgreybeard
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Re: Extreme Gridwatch Events Winter 2022/23

#54

Post by Oldgreybeard »

Stinsy wrote: Tue Nov 29, 2022 4:40 pm What is the impact of the football match?

Will factories shut down and therefore reduce demand?
Will millions od fridges opening every few mins to get beer out increase demand?
Used to be all the hundreds of thousands of kettles going on at half time, I think. Not sure that tea and coffee drinking is that big a thing any more, though.
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Re: Extreme Gridwatch Events Winter 2022/23

#55

Post by dan_b »

Exactly this - the UK has the biggest TV-schedule-led electricity ramp of any country in the world - normally driven by people watching Soaps like Eastenders - but basically it's the "ooh let's put on the kettle for a cuppa" during adverts/half time which is peculiar to the UK. 10 million 3kW electric kettles all going on at once has a big impact on grid stability. Every. Single. Day.
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Re: Extreme Gridwatch Events Winter 2022/23

#56

Post by Oldgreybeard »

I read ages ago that another consequence of all those cups of tea, and the associated flushing of toilets, was that all the water company booster pumps turned on, due to the step increase in water demand. No idea if it's true, but it would seem to be logical.
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Re: Extreme Gridwatch Events Winter 2022/23

#57

Post by nowty »

We seemed to max out on demand at around 17:40 at just over 41GW on almost full import.

I took a screen shot of both Gridwatch and Energy Numbers as a benchmark against future low wind events.

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nowty
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Re: Extreme Gridwatch Events Winter 2022/23

#58

Post by nowty »

Oldgreybeard wrote: Tue Nov 29, 2022 4:42 pm
Stinsy wrote: Tue Nov 29, 2022 4:40 pm What is the impact of the football match?

Will factories shut down and therefore reduce demand?
Will millions od fridges opening every few mins to get beer out increase demand?
Used to be all the hundreds of thousands of kettles going on at half time, I think. Not sure that tea and coffee drinking is that big a thing any more, though.
I remember a news story back in the 80's about Dinorwig (pumped storage) opening the taps for the kettles at half time on an FA Cup final. So I have been watching gridwatch closely. :ugeek:

Just before half time, demand was 37.17GW (it had been dropping steadily since the peak at 17:40), then it dropped to just below 37GW a couple of mins into half time, but after 10 mins into half time, demand was up to 37.48GW.

And Dinorwig climbed from 0.38GW to 0.86GW from the start of half time to 10 mins into half time.

Now we are back into the second half demand has dropped to just under 37GW again and Dinorwig has dropped to 0.21GW.

Kettles or time delayed fridges coming on after the doors been opened ?

Now as half time was dependant on added minutes and the discretion of the referee, I just imagine one person with their hands around a large valve, taking orders from someone watching the football and shouting, "NOW". :lol:
Last edited by nowty on Tue Nov 29, 2022 8:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
18.7kW PV > 109MWh generated
Ripple 6.6kW Wind + 4.5kW PV > 26MWh generated
5 Other RE Coop's
105kWh EV storage
60kWh Home battery storage
40kWh Thermal storage
GSHP + A2A HP's
Rain water use > 510 m3
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Re: Extreme Gridwatch Events Winter 2022/23

#59

Post by Mr Gus »

Oldgreybeard wrote: Tue Nov 29, 2022 6:44 pm I read ages ago that another consequence of all those cups of tea, and the associated flushing of toilets, was that all the water company booster pumps turned on, due to the step increase in water demand. No idea if it's true, but it would seem to be logical.
You raised it OGB, the crowds need to know fact / fiction on that one ...go for it, (fly on the wall when they take that call)
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Re: Extreme Gridwatch Events Winter 2022/23

#60

Post by Joeboy »

Gas tracker unit price has risen 371% across the month of Nov.
From 3.59p to 13.34p per kWh. :o
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