Home Battery without Solar

[Stinsy]

I reckon that about sums it up. I'll source a 22 or 42U rack for the batteries and get some mechanism to fit the Inverter and cabling. The consumer units are directly behind the wall (I think) where the inverter and batteries will sit in the garage.

I dont really trust myself going near the consumer units if I can avoid it, there is a few MCB's that can be changed as we had a shower unit removed and a few years ago had the immersion heater swapped out as we had a combi boiler (oh to be able to see into the future ^^).

So pretty basic sparky stuff really I was tempted to actually go on a sparky course I'm sure they do them online too just to gain some more confidence.

My lack of confidence aside, everything in the bundle from Bimble seems to tick the boxes.

This kit is a larger kit for storing excess energy from an existing grid-tied solar PV installation, or for storing cheap night-time energy (off-peak tarifs e.g. Octopus) for use during the day and peak tarif times.

More battery modules can be added at any time, and AC coupled or DC coupled solar PV can also be added to further decrease consumption from the grid, saving even more off your bills.

This system has an integrated MPPT, so is ready for a DC coupled PV installation at any moment.

NB: The 5kVA Victron EasySolar-II has received G98/99 certification on the ENA type test register, see link: https://www.ena-eng.org/gen-ttr/Index.a ... tab=search

That ticks all the boxes, I'm going to go through the specs and try to ensure that it'll meet my needs battery discharge rate, inverter rates etc to determine I can charge the batteries (and any others I might buy) during my off peak period.

I can then see some immediate reduction in costs (assuming BG dont cock up this solution, or ask me for the v5c to prove I've got an EV ^^), the pressure is then off building (and seeking relevant permissions if needs be) the bespoke garden PV solution.

I did the sparky course back when it was 16th edition. Cost a grand and took 4 Weeks full time. I was qualified to be an “electrical installer” thereafter but I needed to pay £400 a year to maintain my accreditation and I wasn’t qualified to do EICRs. I wanted to do my own electrical work renovating properties, so it was a bit of a waste of time/money except for the fact that I enjoyed it and learned about the regs and how to apply them to real world situations. On the last day I asked the guy teaching the course what direction electrons traveled in a DC circuit and how fast they went. He gave wrong answers to both questions so clearly didn’t actually know how electricity works. I nodded and thanked him. I wouldn’t have hired any of the other guys from the course to change a lightbulb, none were particularly bright nor had practical skills, they were drawn in on promises of “guaranteed £30k jobs” at the end of the course.

[Tay]

ummm then aside from self interest perhaps not much value for me then. Although what you've said might well explain the shoddy responses I've had thus far, perhaps the mobile phone was too much to master.

Even I know the direction of electron travel, thanks to this forums mind -ive to +ive

I laugh but its actually quite worrying really.

[chris_n]

I reckon that about sums it up. I'll source a 22 or 42U rack for the batteries and get some mechanism to fit the Inverter and cabling. The consumer units are directly behind the wall (I think) where the inverter and batteries will sit in the garage.

I dont really trust myself going near the consumer units if I can avoid it, there is a few MCB's that can be changed as we had a shower unit removed and a few years ago had the immersion heater swapped out as we had a combi boiler (oh to be able to see into the future ^^).

So pretty basic sparky stuff really I was tempted to actually go on a sparky course I'm sure they do them online too just to gain some more confidence.

My lack of confidence aside, everything in the bundle from Bimble seems to tick the boxes.

This kit is a larger kit for storing excess energy from an existing grid-tied solar PV installation, or for storing cheap night-time energy (off-peak tarifs e.g. Octopus) for use during the day and peak tarif times.

More battery modules can be added at any time, and AC coupled or DC coupled solar PV can also be added to further decrease consumption from the grid, saving even more off your bills.

This system has an integrated MPPT, so is ready for a DC coupled PV installation at any moment.

NB: The 5kVA Victron EasySolar-II has received G98/99 certification on the ENA type test register, see link: https://www.ena-eng.org/gen-ttr/Index.a ... tab=search

That ticks all the boxes, I'm going to go through the specs and try to ensure that it'll meet my needs battery discharge rate, inverter rates etc to determine I can charge the batteries (and any others I might buy) during my off peak period.

I can then see some immediate reduction in costs (assuming BG dont cock up this solution, or ask me for the v5c to prove I've got an EV ^^), the pressure is then off building (and seeking relevant permissions if needs be) the bespoke garden PV solution.

I did the sparky course back when it was 16th edition. Cost a grand and took 4 Weeks full time. I was qualified to be an “electrical installer” thereafter but I needed to pay £400 a year to maintain my accreditation and I wasn’t qualified to do EICRs. I wanted to do my own electrical work renovating properties, so it was a bit of a waste of time/money except for the fact that I enjoyed it and learned about the regs and how to apply them to real world situations. On the last day I asked the guy teaching the course what direction electrons traveled in a DC circuit and how fast they went. He gave wrong answers to both questions so clearly didn’t actually know how electricity works. I nodded and thanked him. I wouldn’t have hired any of the other guys from the course to change a lightbulb, none were particularly bright nor had practical skills, they were drawn in on promises of “guaranteed £30k jobs” at the end of the course.

I did a 17th Edition course, my background is in Mechanical Engineering and at the time I was employed in a large multinational automotive company as Facilities Engineer. A lot of my work revolved around ventilation / process extraction etc in a very closely controlled electronics manufacturing facility, part of my work was supervising contractors with electrical installations hence the course. Prior to the course the only electrical training I had was a one week module as a first year apprentice fitter with NCB covering such things as wiring plugs correctly. I did the course with 4 NHS electricians and a couple of other industrial sparkies. I was by far the highest scoring on the course and was absolutely appalled at the standard of the NHS guys

[AGT]

I reckon that about sums it up. I'll source a 22 or 42U rack for the batteries and get some mechanism to fit the Inverter and cabling. The consumer units are directly behind the wall (I think) where the inverter and batteries will sit in the garage.

I dont really trust myself going near the consumer units if I can avoid it, there is a few MCB's that can be changed as we had a shower unit removed and a few years ago had the immersion heater swapped out as we had a combi boiler (oh to be able to see into the future ^^).

So pretty basic sparky stuff really I was tempted to actually go on a sparky course I'm sure they do them online too just to gain some more confidence.

My lack of confidence aside, everything in the bundle from Bimble seems to tick the boxes.

This kit is a larger kit for storing excess energy from an existing grid-tied solar PV installation, or for storing cheap night-time energy (off-peak tarifs e.g. Octopus) for use during the day and peak tarif times.

More battery modules can be added at any time, and AC coupled or DC coupled solar PV can also be added to further decrease consumption from the grid, saving even more off your bills.

This system has an integrated MPPT, so is ready for a DC coupled PV installation at any moment.

NB: The 5kVA Victron EasySolar-II has received G98/99 certification on the ENA type test register, see link: https://www.ena-eng.org/gen-ttr/Index.a ... tab=search

That ticks all the boxes, I'm going to go through the specs and try to ensure that it'll meet my needs battery discharge rate, inverter rates etc to determine I can charge the batteries (and any others I might buy) during my off peak period.

I can then see some immediate reduction in costs (assuming BG dont cock up this solution, or ask me for the v5c to prove I've got an EV ^^), the pressure is then off building (and seeking relevant permissions if needs be) the bespoke garden PV solution.

I did the sparky course back when it was 16th edition. Cost a grand and took 4 Weeks full time. I was qualified to be an “electrical installer” thereafter but I needed to pay £400 a year to maintain my accreditation and I wasn’t qualified to do EICRs. I wanted to do my own electrical work renovating properties, so it was a bit of a waste of time/money except for the fact that I enjoyed it and learned about the regs and how to apply them to real world situations. On the last day I asked the guy teaching the course what direction electrons traveled in a DC circuit and how fast they went. He gave wrong answers to both questions so clearly didn’t actually know how electricity works. I nodded and thanked him. I wouldn’t have hired any of the other guys from the course to change a lightbulb, none were particularly bright nor had practical skills, they were drawn in on promises of “guaranteed £30k jobs” at the end of the course.

I do think the 4 week course can’t teach everything to everybody so it was tailored just to make money for the accreditation industry, so the tutor probably was just delivering the course

Those doing a 4 year apprentice would have more of a rounded skill set, as the tutors at least where my local college were always ex electricians that then went into training/teaching

However in both there will be dafties and those that take an interest.

[GarethC]

This is what I am hoping to do initially, but I have seen the light (excuse the pun) with Solar and want to do something with it, but it wont be roof mounted initially, the gains couldnt justify the scaffolding cost.

But with Hybrid inverter & Batteries I could see an instant benefit, just cant find anybody to do it.

I keep looking at the Victron battery solution on Bimble Inverter+Battery and my fingers are getting twitchy for that price, but nobody seems interested in talking about installing it down this way. I'm tempted just to buy the damn thing and see what I can install myself then find a sparky for the last few bits off checkatrade.

I'll have a chat with Bimble again and see if they can recommend a local installer/electrician for that bundle, gives me the option to expand with Solar later plus add additonal storage which would give me 90-100% off grid during the day and top up with my current ToU tariff.

Adding Solar at some point would give me even more independence.

14kWh is a good size. I've wondered myself, as I can't do solar either, about going even larger. A 25kWh+ setup charged with off peak, low carbon electricity would hopefully allow almost no use of peak rate high carbon electricity.

I've been looking at Alibaba systems, as the prices are unsurprisingly extremely keen. Yes a ton of due diligence would be required, setup would be difficult and there's a host of other potential pitfalls. Shipping and tax would add to the cost.

But I'd love to have time to explore more. At the end of the day the vast majority of LiFePO4 batteries are made in China, so it should be possible to get decent quality ones at better prices, shouldn't it?

[Krill]

I had a 3*Pylontech US5000 battery system fitted in April (so around 14kWh storage), and in general it lasts from one cheap charging cycle to the next. The only time it doesn't is if I absolutely hammer it by using the tumble dryer and oven for a fair chunk of the day.

OTOH, this is only for a two person household but with slightly heavier than normal use. The cost of using normal rate electric for a few hours from, say 2200 to 0200 a couple of days a year is far cheaper than paying for an extra battery, and if the grid were to go out (if you get the house islanded) then it is trivial to alter the use to prolong power availability for critical use.

I'd second the point that ~14, 15kWh is a good target to aim for.

[nowty]

I've been looking at Alibaba systems, as the prices are unsurprisingly extremely keen. Yes a ton of due diligence would be required, setup would be difficult and there's a host of other potential pitfalls. Shipping and tax would add to the cost.

But I'd love to have time to explore more. At the end of the day the vast majority of LiFePO4 batteries are made in China, so it should be possible to get decent quality ones at better prices, shouldn't it?

There are plenty of threads on here where folk have done that including Joeboy's epic one,
https://camelot-forum.co.uk/phpBB3/view ... 422#p15422

[richbee]

I had a 3*Pylontech US5000 battery system fitted in April (so around 14kWh storage), and in general it lasts from one cheap charging cycle to the next. The only time it doesn't is if I absolutely hammer it by using the tumble dryer and oven for a fair chunk of the day.

OTOH, this is only for a two person household but with slightly heavier than normal use. The cost of using normal rate electric for a few hours from, say 2200 to 0200 a couple of days a year is far cheaper than paying for an extra battery, and if the grid were to go out (if you get the house islanded) then it is trivial to alter the use to prolong power availability for critical use.

I'd second the point that ~14, 15kWh is a good target to aim for.

That's why I have (so far) stopped at 10kWh - our average use is around 12kWh, but the payback for a 3rd battery is not worth it currently. The 2nd one to go from 5 to 10 was definitely worth it, and even more so since we changed to Octopus Flux - with the battery filled up overnight on cheap rate.
Although I can't say I wasn't tempted when the Sunsynk CATL batteries were briefly on offer at £1400 instead of £2000+ the other week!!!

[Thebeeman]

We have 4 kW of Solar and recently, August 22, installed 10.5 kW of batteries. We've added another 5 Kw battery. I'm charging, on off peak to 80% , and that sees us through till the next cheap session and any solar is just a bonus. The night time charge is about 9 Kwh 'ish now in November, at 14 pence per unit. We have been known to run the dishwasher or washing machine overnight is the weather forecast is rubbish. We are a mean 2 person, pensioner household. With the OP's 8000 kWh per year he's going to struggle during the winter without huge battery capacity.

[Tay]

I need a little more juice, so I'd add another Pylontech 3000 to the mix or maybe 2 more ^^.

I'm less worried about the capital expenditure as I have the cash now, what I want to do is reduce the dependancy on utility companies, I'm sure not all are as bad as British Gas but I have the opportunity to to be pretty much independent of them as much as possible and should I get solar in have the option to top up with solar as needed or resell it or both.

My usage is a bit distorted right now as I'm hammering off peak, but the bills are still heading in the right direction although they are now flatlining slightly as Solar generation tapers away for the winter.

If I can get to the point of 2 days of grid independence I'll be happy, I'm just a little cautious of the inverter included in the bundle, I'm sure I heard something about them, but cant remember where, I dont recall it being anything bad per se, but not as good as it could be and other options might be better.

Right now I'm digging through the spec sheets to ensure it can deliver enough power to charge to top up the batteries off peak and keep most the house going without grid intervention throughout the day.