Balcony solar PV

[Moxi]

Was thinking much the same thing about whether their grid was so much more robust than ours ?

For the uk I have also wondered if things would be better if the DNO was paid a bonus to get folk to have solar in the same way the energy suppliers are for smart meter installs.

Might make them more attentive?

Moxi

[Joeboy]

I think 'where's the money' who is the vested interest'. Then Ignore both thoughts and do my own thing

I hope to see a mighty 2kWh out of the now to be Hoymiles Turkish system. It doesn't balance out on a cost/return basis but it does on cleanliness alone which Is enough for me.

[Joeboy]

In from Germany.

https://www.pv-magazine.com/2024/07/19/ ... -mw-in-h1/

Good for them. I wonder if we are over-protective (e.g. no live plugs) or our networks are just more fragile/ underinvested than theirs?
I imagine the inverter for balcony pv could easily be made to not export if there was no mains voltage - i.e. the output not plugged in.

It does this, it's a safe system.

[AE-NMidlands]

In from Germany.

https://www.pv-magazine.com/2024/07/19/ ... -mw-in-h1/

Good for them. I wonder if we are over-protective (e.g. no live plugs) or our networks are just more fragile/ underinvested than theirs?
I imagine the inverter for balcony pv could easily be made to not export if there was no mains voltage - i.e. the output not plugged in.

It does this, it's a safe system.

yes, but a) I don't know if they do,
and b) I can imagine UK regulators saying "if it goes wrong there will be a live plug" and banning it on that basis - regardless of society's gain from these cheap and easy things getting widespread uptake or the actual risk of the failure (if it happened) being followed by somebody touching the plug pins.

[Joeboy]

Good for them. I wonder if we are over-protective (e.g. no live plugs) or our networks are just more fragile/ underinvested than theirs?
I imagine the inverter for balcony pv could easily be made to not export if there was no mains voltage - i.e. the output not plugged in.

It does this, it's a safe system.

yes, but a) I don't know if they do,
and b) I can imagine UK regulators saying "if it goes wrong there will be a live plug" and banning it on that basis - regardless of society's gain from these cheap and easy things getting widespread uptake or the actual risk of the failure (if it happened) being followed by somebody touching the plug pins.

Rather than spreading disinformation (twice) why not do the research first? I can imagine a lot of things but mumping my gums about dead flogged horses ifs buts and maybes years later isn't a constructive pastime I go for or indulge in, bye for now.

[AE-NMidlands]

It does this, it's a safe system.

yes, but a) I don't know if they do,
and b) I can imagine UK regulators saying "if it goes wrong there will be a live plug" and banning it on that basis - regardless of society's gain from these cheap and easy things getting widespread uptake or the actual risk of the failure (if it happened) being followed by somebody touching the plug pins.

Rather than spreading disinformation (twice) why not do the research first? I can imagine a lot of things but mumping my gums about dead flogged horses ifs buts and maybes years later isn't a constructive past time I go for or indulge in, bye for now.

Sorry, I read that as "If It does this, it's a safe system." Thanks for that... But don't you agree that UK regulators have form for being over-protective?
Googling (which will probably produce far more rubbish than a single response from someone here "in the know" ) has found https://community.bluettipower.com/t/bl ... ma/26712/5
which says

Does the System work in a power outage?
Every Balcony System shutsoff in case of a power failure. The Inverter checks if there is the right grid voltage (in case for germany 230V) and the right grid frequenz (50hz). If one of the values are too low, the inverter will stop deliever power to the house circuit. This is related to a safety feature. When you unplug the AC Plug, its the same effect. To safe the person from a electrical shock, the inverter need to cut the power within miliseconds.

It sounds good, but I would still rather take informed opinion here than a websearch result...

[chris_n]

yes, but a) I don't know if they do,
and b) I can imagine UK regulators saying "if it goes wrong there will be a live plug" and banning it on that basis - regardless of society's gain from these cheap and easy things getting widespread uptake or the actual risk of the failure (if it happened) being followed by somebody touching the plug pins.

Rather than spreading disinformation (twice) why not do the research first? I can imagine a lot of things but mumping my gums about dead flogged horses ifs buts and maybes years later isn't a constructive past time I go for or indulge in, bye for now.

Sorry, I read that as "If It does this, it's a safe system." Thanks for that... But don't you agree that UK regulators have form for being over-protective?
Googling (which will probably produce far more rubbish than a single response from someone here "in the know" ) has found https://community.bluettipower.com/t/bl ... ma/26712/5
which says

Does the System work in a power outage?
Every Balcony System shutsoff in case of a power failure. The Inverter checks if there is the right grid voltage (in case for germany 230V) and the right grid frequenz (50hz). If one of the values are too low, the inverter will stop deliever power to the house circuit. This is related to a safety feature. When you unplug the AC Plug, its the same effect. To safe the person from a electrical shock, the inverter need to cut the power within miliseconds.

It sounds good, but I would still rather take informed opinion here than a websearch result...

For a system to comply with UK spec it needs to do exactly that, the times etc are in the regulations not a websearch.
One of the problems is that you prevent the circuit protection from working when you introduce a secondary supply upstream of the breaker which can allow more current to flow than the wiring can handle. Other European countries do not have ring mains that can be seriously overloaded if the ring is broken and you don't know about it because everything still works.
In Europe all circuits are radial so you don't have the same problems, i.e. if a circuit in UK is fused at 32A it is likely a ring wired in 2.5mm cable which can carry 20A on each leg which is already a problem if the ring is broken even before you add the generation current, in Europe it will be a radial wired in 6mm cable which can take 40A so no problem adding 800W somewhere on the radial leg, you can't overload it.

[Joeboy]

Chris n description is excellent although I'll take the 3.5A risk to gain 800W generation over a days arc on either circuit type.

I think of it as a chainsaw analogy. We can all go out and buy chainsaws but it doesn't mean we are fit to use them safely or around others. Yet they are available to buy at our own risk.

I.think the benefits of the 800W balcony systems outweigh the risk of wiring differences.

Although that's just my view and in no way changes wiring reality. A balcony system can be run back through a fused dedicated line to its own breaker in the CU and have absolutely no risk involved.

At the same time, some nugget could buy and run four 1600W balcony systems through the same ring straight into a pair of twin sockets which as Chris suggests could be a broken ring and already has a washing machine, two freezers, a 4 kW resistive heater and sadly SWMBO just fired up the iron. I hope she doesn't get the blame.

With power comes responsibility and my view is that the individual should be able to make an informed decision off their own back and not be curtailed by state protecting the lowest Darwinian award candidates. That's as close to politics as I'll allow myself to go.

I don't want to see internal wall fires but there is a middle ground being avoided in the UK which is sad. Especially when you read of the gains being made in Germany which I applaud

Truly "Power to the people", decentralised and possibly nodal due to uptake/population density demands.

[Joeboy]

Had a quick count. This is my 9th microinverter bought. Six secondhand (one of which doesn't like the grid here, the other five are working now in Scotland). Of the three bought new, one blew up on its second power up and was binned (lesson learned, WMC Chinese maker is shite). I particularly like the style of these Rinky dinky Hoymiles 350's (also Chinese and very much not shite).. Other than the troublesome app access but that is due to UK rules and is literally just a software block).



Only does one thing. Can series link a few smaller panels into it. Hopefully has app access. It does have app access but I've not seen it running yet here in Turkey since it's in transit to Scotland.

I think there's something very cool about these units. Very open to older, smaller panel series hookup in tight space, maybe multiple orientation. Yet will get the job done quietly with no fuss.

None of them, not even the Chinese shite would output power without a grid connection.

[richbee]

Had a quick count. This is my 9th microinverter bought. Six secondhand (one of which doesn't like the grid here, the other five are working now in Scotland). Of the three bought new, one blew up on its second power up and was binned (lesson learned, WMC Chinese maker is shite). I particularly like the style of these Rinky dinky Hoymiles 350's (also Chinese and very much not shite).. Other than the troublesome app access but that is due to UK rules and is literally just a software block).



Only does one thing. Can series link a few smaller panels into it. Hopefully has app access. It does have app access but I've not seen it running yet here in Turkey since it's in transit to Scotland.

I think there's something very cool about these units. Very open to older, smaller panel series hookup in tight space, maybe multiple orientation. Yet will get the job done quietly with no fuss.

None of them, not even the Chinese shite would output power without a grid connection.

I'm guessing you haven't come up with a cunning plan about the app access yet? Can you get access in Turkey?