Timeshifting power use mainstream

[Joeboy]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62626908

[rogeriko]

I do that now, only with my batteries.

[Tinbum]

So do i so I'd better shift it all back otherwise I can't benefit!!

[Oldgreybeard]

What REALLY annoys me is that there is an absolutely massive penalty for those that are time shifting, but for reasons competely beyond their control, are not able to have a smart meter, because the things don't work in their area. We've been on Economy 7 for years, and about 98% of our consumption is during the E7 overnight, off-peak, period. Despite this our bill increased by about 230% in April and is set to increase by another 200% in October, as it seems that E7 standard variable tariffs are not subject to the OFGEM price cap.

I would love to have a smart meter, we actually had one for about 6 months, but despite the best endeavours of the meter fitters (they must have come back half a dozen times) the thing would not connect. Doesn't surprise me, as we barely get a mobile signal here - only way we can get a phone to work is to open an upstairs window and lean out. I've been told that the smart meter connectivity problem won't be fixed, as the powers that be accept that around 10% of them won't work because they can't connect. Seems wrong to me that we should be so heavily penalised for doing the best we can, just because the people that have created the smart meter system cannot be bothered to make it work everywhere.

[nowty]

What REALLY annoys me is that there is an absolutely massive penalty for those that are time shifting, but for reasons competely beyond their control, are not able to have a smart meter, because the things don't work in their area. We've been on Economy 7 for years, and about 98% of our consumption is during the E7 overnight, off-peak, period. Despite this our bill increased by about 230% in April and is set to increase by another 200% in October, as it seems that E7 standard variable tariffs are not subject to the OFGEM price cap.

E7 variable tariffs are subject to the OFGEM capped rates, the assumption is for an increased standard usage of 4,200 kWh per day vs 3,100 kWh usage for a single rate meters and the average cost per kWh is cheaper on multi rate meters but more overall because of the 35% higher usage.

Current OFGEM Price Caps
https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/sites/default/ ... 202022.pdf

Example, Octopus capped leccy rates in my area are,

Single rate 28.46p / kWh

Multi Rate 30.78p / kWh (day), 21.24p / kWh (night)

I sympathise that this does not help the not being able to get a SMART meter.

[Joeboy]

SWMBO & I are giving serious consideration to running an armoured cable over to our sons house next door and run his big lounge storage heater off of our 5 hour go faster window and just runnit through a simple digital meter. It will knock the props out from under his Winter heating bills although he is on E7 split across two.meters and that hacks me off that he is charged two sc's....

[Oliver90owner]

Despite this our bill increased by about 230% in April

Do you really mean the increase was to about 330% or do you really mean it increased by about 130% to 230 % of the previous?

I honestly cannot understand how it increased by 230% (to 330%) unless you were on a fixed term tariff previously.

[Oldgreybeard]

What REALLY annoys me is that there is an absolutely massive penalty for those that are time shifting, but for reasons competely beyond their control, are not able to have a smart meter, because the things don't work in their area. We've been on Economy 7 for years, and about 98% of our consumption is during the E7 overnight, off-peak, period. Despite this our bill increased by about 230% in April and is set to increase by another 200% in October, as it seems that E7 standard variable tariffs are not subject to the OFGEM price cap.

E7 variable tariffs are subject to the OFGEM capped rates, the assumption is for an increased standard usage of 4,200 kWh per day vs 3,100 kWh usage for a single rate meters and the average cost per kWh is cheaper on multi rate meters but more overall because of the 35% higher usage.

Current OFGEM Price Caps
https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/sites/default/ ... 202022.pdf

Example, Octopus capped leccy rates in my area are,

Single rate 28.46p / kWh

Multi Rate 30.78p / kWh (day), 21.24p / kWh (night)

I sympathise that this does not help the not being able to get a SMART meter.

Didn't stop suppliers hiking the off-peak rate (which is pretty much all we use) by well over 200% in April, when the cap was set at 54%, though. Our heating and hot water bill, small as it is, went up by a factor of 2.3 in April and we are being told to expect it to double again in October, so the real bill we will be paying will have risen by well over 400% over about 6 months. Makes the OFGEM cap look like a complete joke from my perspective.

Suppliers are unfairly loading off-peak rates, probably as there are only around 4 million of us using Economy 7, so they can get away with it. I get what they are doing, they can make a bigger profit by hiking off-peak rates, and can use that to subsidise peak rates on other tariffs. Doesn't make it fair, though.

[Joeboy]

Just pulled this off the Octopus site. Seems to be about average for new folk. That's hellacious

Just Move In Planet Friendly 12M Fixed August 2022 v1

Eco 7 ElectricityDay unit rate:75.54 p/kWhNight unit rate:55.98 p/kWhStanding charge:51.62 p/day
ElectricityUnit rate:74.4 p/kWhStanding charge:51.53 p/day

GasUnit rate:20.24 p/kWhStanding charge:28.17 p/day

[Oldgreybeard]

Just pulled this off the Octopus site. Seems to be about average for new folk. That's hellacious

Just Move In Planet Friendly 12M Fixed August 2022 v1

Eco 7 ElectricityDay unit rate:75.54 p/kWhNight unit rate:55.98 p/kWhStanding charge:51.62 p/day
ElectricityUnit rate:74.4 p/kWhStanding charge:51.53 p/day

GasUnit rate:20.24 p/kWhStanding charge:28.17 p/day

That's what they are all doing now, hiking the off-peak rate to way, way above the off-peak wholesale cost. I've just double checked, and our off-peak rate actually increased by 236% in April, and I've had an email to warn that it will rise by about another 200% in October. That means that our heating and hot water bill this winter will increase by 470% compared with last winter.

Luckily that bill was only a couple of hundred pounds last year, so in real terms it increasing to around £1,000 isn't that big a deal, but it is still a hefty hike and doesn't incentivise anyone to time shift and use more off-peak.