Part ownership of a Ripple Wind Turbine, fancy it?

[Joeboy]

Thank you ............concise answer i was looking for.........
Understand , ....= invest more , consume less ─ retire earlier
George

I took advantage of the 12 monthly payments option when I did my second top up for Kirkhill. Realised its quite an extended timeline to switch on day so why not do similar with payment? Not trying to put temptation in your way or anything!
Can address (minimise) the tax issue by using a stocks & shares ISA for yourself and SWMBO for other investments. 9.64p per kWh generated is a pleasant surprise

If you pay in instalments you pay a 8.4% (inc VAT) arrangement fee, if you pay a single instalment you pay a 7.2% (inc VAT) arrangement fee.

For WT1 the arrangement fee was 5% (inc VAT). I thought that was fair because its similar to what I pay with Venture Capital Trust investments. The higher fees on WT2 are a bit steep.

Happy to pay the extra 1% and leave the funds generating elsewhere

[Marcus]

I have been umm-ing and ah-ing about whether or not to join ripple; my annual electricity bills have been less than £100 for a few years - and that was before i added another 3.5kw of pv for when the hydro isn't working. But now that i can't avoid a standing charge that's changed, and i have been thinking of wheher to commit to off grid and get disconnected, or stick with the grid but try and make it 'pay' for itself, and thought that ripple might do that (if I've understood correctly, and can buy a large enough share).

I am with octopus and have requested a smart meter but there's been no sign of progress on that front, so using something like agile to offset the standing charge isn't yet an option.

Am i correct that if i have ripple income that it would offset my standing charge if I'm not using electricity?

[nowty]

I have been umm-ing and ah-ing about whether or not to join ripple; my annual electricity bills have been less than £100 for a few years - and that was before i added another 3.5kw of pv for when the hydro isn't working. But now that i can't avoid a standing charge that's changed, and i have been thinking of wheher to commit to off grid and get disconnected, or stick with the grid but try and make it 'pay' for itself, and thought that ripple might do that (if I've understood correctly, and can buy a large enough share).

I am with octopus and have requested a smart meter but there's been no sign of progress on that front, so using something like agile to offset the standing charge isn't yet an option.

Am i correct that if i have ripple income that it would offset my standing charge if I'm not using electricity?

Yes, just exaggerate your usage up to 6999kWh and buy as little or as much up to that figure and no evidence of usage will be required. You get your rebate in full even if your entire bill just consists of your standing charge.

EDIT - Just checked the Ripple calculator, the max you can buy without required evidence is 2206 watts or £4137.
NOTE - This assumes you don't have any previous investment in WT1 Graig Fatha.

[Joeboy]

I am holding back on buying more Kirkhill in the hope that I can be involved in WT3 too. I truly hope its an offshore set up just for the craick! If it is I'll being hog heaven!

I understand that it's all very early and the 'moving now'. I look forward to Ripple clarifying volume that can be purchased and type of investment vehicle/tax opportunities in WT3. Ever hopefull!

[AE-NMidlands]

I have been umm-ing and ah-ing about whether or not to join ripple; my annual electricity bills have been less than £100 for a few years - and that was before i added another 3.5kw of pv for when the hydro isn't working. But now that i can't avoid a standing charge that's changed, and i have been thinking of wheher to commit to off grid and get disconnected, or stick with the grid but try and make it 'pay' for itself, and thought that ripple might do that (if I've understood correctly, and can buy a large enough share).

I am with octopus and have requested a smart meter but there's been no sign of progress on that front, so using something like agile to offset the standing charge isn't yet an option.

Am i correct that if i have ripple income that it would offset my standing charge if I'm not using electricity?

I was with Coop so now on a coop dual-fuel tariff with Octopus. They simply credited my account with March's Ripple money on 21st April - and I promptly went into my account and knocked my direct debit down by £20. I don't imagine any other provider allows you to tell them what your dd will be that easily.
I know they have to agree it with you, but that usually means you phoning them and having the argument to reduce what they want to take. Not with Octopus.
A

[Marcus]

Ok, these are the details that tend to put me off this kind of thing:

Reading term, etc, if i reach my tax threshold, i would need to declare "earnings" from the wt - will i get an annual earning cert from ripple?

Does anyone know what happens at the end of life of the wt? I.e. if decommissioned, as a shareholder would i become liable for costs? The faq section does mention this but doesn't explicitly say one wouldn't be liable.

[nowty]

Ok, these are the details that tend to put me off this kind of thing:

Reading term, etc, if i reach my tax threshold, i would need to declare "earnings" from the wt - will i get an annual earning cert from ripple?

Does anyone know what happens at the end of life of the wt? I.e. if decommissioned, as a shareholder would i become liable for costs? The faq section does mention this but doesn't explicitly say one wouldn't be liable.

I believe ripple (or the coop) are going to issue tax certificates, like banks and building societies to make it easier to declare your interest income.

During the life of the turbine the coop has to remain solvent so will have spare funds available and the ability to borrow short term if required to fix problems. So although the risk is for a lower income because, lets say the coop needs 3p or 4p per kWh to cover its operating costs its very unlikely for members to have to stump up actual extra cash during the lifetime of the asset. And even if it came to that, if say you had no cash to pay any more in, then you would simply be diluted in your share of the asset as someone else pays more.

At end of life, there should still be a funds available for decommissioning and although there may be a small risk of requiring funds from the coop, there is more likely a final bonus of selling on the turbine or the steel in the tower etc.

At the end of life, I think the most likely outcomes would be,

a) The turbine can have its life extended for say 10 or 15 more years but funds will be required from shareholders for a refurbishment. If you don't want to be part of that, then you just withdraw and let others buy in.

b) A new turbine is proposed, again, if you don't want to be part of it, you just withdraw and let others buy in.

c) Sell the asset as a going concern to another operator, might end up with a final leaving bonus.

d) Completely decommission, demolish and remove. Funds in the coop should cover it and with selling the asset for re-use or scrap might even provide for a final leaving bonus. But I believe this is the least likely outcome unless wind turbines became totally uneconomic.

[Marcus]

Thanks Nowty, i always get neurotic about these financial things - probably why I'm still poor.

[AE-NMidlands]

New update on my account page:

First full month Graig Fatha generation numbers
01/05/2022

Initial indications are that the Graig Fatha turbine has exceeded the most optimistic estimates of output for April. That is despite wind speeds lower than modelled and the turbine being switched off for periods for testing and servicing.

Generation was 462,000 kWh whereas the P75 level we based ownership on suggested 407,000 kWh of output for April. This is 13% above the P75 level set out in the share offer document.

This is quite a surprise (to me) as a) I would have thought that April would be quite a windy month - so their long-range estimate would be high but this year has disappointed, and b) my outturn has been 25 to 50% of predicted output almost every day, and has averaged 52% since I started keeping a record of the predictions.
A

[nowty]

New update on my account page:

First full month Graig Fatha generation numbers
01/05/2022

Initial indications are that the Graig Fatha turbine has exceeded the most optimistic estimates of output for April. That is despite wind speeds lower than modelled and the turbine being switched off for periods for testing and servicing.

Generation was 462,000 kWh whereas the P75 level we based ownership on suggested 407,000 kWh of output for April. This is 13% above the P75 level set out in the share offer document.

This is quite a surprise (to me) as a) I would have thought that April would be quite a windy month - so their long-range estimate would be high but this year has disappointed, and b) my outturn has been 25 to 50% of predicted output almost every day, and has averaged 52% since I started keeping a record of the predictions.
A

This is exceptionally good news for the secret list of WT1 members and not surprising if ripple were honest in their share offer by using the P75 and not the P50 figures as used for WT2. I agree their prediction on their live website is complete rubbish but that's irrelevant.

The difference between their P50 and P75 annual generation figures for WT1 was about 10%. They also took off another 2% to be conservative possibly because of the other existing wind turbines upwind. So if its generated 13% more than expected with less wind resource and with the 500hr service shutdowns, then WT1 members might have bought into something even better value than WT2 offers.

He / she who dares, .....................